Author Topic: Mengapa Adventisme sering dianggap bidat/bukan Kristen?  (Read 9289 times)

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March 18, 2014, 09:58:15 PM
Reply #10
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http://www.sarapanpagi.org/adventis-vt6591.html#p28406
http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Religions/Seventh-Day%20Adventist/walter_veith_heretic.htm
http://www.exadventist.com/home/intro/tabid/64/default.aspx
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080813175014AAUrY3R

Seventh-Day Adventism began in the mid-nineteenth century, when a Baptist preacher, who later repented of his folly, predicted that Jesus Christ would return in 1844. Miller had over 10,000 followers, many of whom sold their homes, gave away all their earthly possessions, quit their jobs, and waited eagerly for the Lord's return--But the Lord didn't return in 1844! In came Ellen G. White (one of the founders, whose extensive writings are still held in high regard by the church today) to save the day, claiming that instead of returning to the earth, Jesus entered into the Holy of Holies in Heaven to finish His work of atonement. She termed this event the "Investigative Judgment," a doctrine not found anywhere in the Word of God.

Seventh-day Adventists, in the early days, denied the Trinity, but now they accept it. However, they have "leftovers" from this heresy. Ellen G. White wrote in Patriarchs and Prophets, page 761, "...He (Jesus) was revealed to them as the Angel of Jehovah, the Captain of the Lord's Host, Michael the Archangel".

Seventh Day Adventists mostly use "The Clear Word Bible"- Translated by a SDA member in 1994 - The Clear Word Bible Teaches Jesus is Michael

Jude 1:9
King James Bible - "Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee."
Clear Word Bible - "In contrast to these ungodly men is the Lord Jesus Christ, also called Michael, the archangel in charge of the entire angelic host. When He was challenged by Satan about His intentions to resurrect Moses, He didn't come against Satan with a blistering attack nor did he belittle him. He simply said, 'God rejects your claim to his body.'"

Ellen G. White also wrote...

"Michael, or Christ, with the angels that buried Moses..." (Jude 9, Spiritual Gifts, IV a, p. 158)

"And before the context closed Christ Himself came to Gabriel's aid--Gabriel declares 'But lo, Michael, one of the Chief Princes came to help me" (Daniel 10:13, Prophets & Kings, p.572)

"There is none that holdeth with me in these things but Michael (Christ) your prince." (Desire of Ages, p.99)

"Moses passed under the dominion of death - but Christ the Savior brought him forth from the grave." (Jude 9, ibid 379).
There other cults, that Jesus Christ is Michael the archangel. The Jehovah's Witnesses teach this same damnable heresy! This is a subtle heresy, that attacks the deity of Christ.

Celakanya, pembelaan dari situs adventis justru meng-IYA-kan semua ajaran ellen white yaitu YESUS adalah Malaikat!

http://adventist-defense-league.blogspot.com/2008/10/who-is-michael-archangel-there-has-been.html
https://adventistbiblicalresearch.org/materials/theology-jesus-christ/michael-another-name-jesus

Salam
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March 21, 2014, 10:44:40 AM
Reply #11
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@bro Malaikat suci
jadi bukan bicara tanpa dasar,,,

ini tanggapan resmi dari Adventist bible research institute mengenai michael yaitu nama lain dari Yesus,,,
michael itu nama/sebutan lain seperti Anak domba Allah, Batu karang, Singa dari Yehuda,
What biblical evidence supports the teaching that Michael is another name for Jesus?

The name Michael is used five times in the Bible to designate a celestial being (Dan. 10:13, 21; 12:1; Jude 9; Rev. 12:7). He is nowhere explicitly identified with Jesus, but some Christian writers have equated the two by carefully comparing the role played by Michael with that of Jesus. Any comparisons yield not only similarities but also dissimilarities, and both should be taken into account. We'll start with the passages in which Michael is mentioned and then broaden the horizon to include several passages that are conceptually related to His person and experience.

1. He seems to be an angel: Michael is identified as "one of the chief princes" (Dan. 10:13), "your prince" (verse 21), "the great prince" (Dan. 12:1), and "the archangel" (Jude 9). "Archangel" implies that He is the prince of the angels, suggesting that Michael cannot be another name for Jesus because He is divine and angels are created beings.

Part of the problem is that the noun "angel" is taken to designate a creature, while in the Bible it designates a function. In other words, an "angel" is a being who functions as a "messenger" of God. In most cases they are created beings, but there is an exception.

In the Old Testament there are several references to the "angel [messenger] of the Lord" in which He is equated with God (e.g., Ex. 3:2, 4; Judges 6:12, 14). It is not that the Messenger is identified with the One who sent Him as His representative, but rather that the Sender functions at the same time as the Messenger. Many Christians have identified the Angel of the Lord as the preincarnate Christ. This Christological interpretation seems to be biblically valid.

2. He is leader of the angels: The phrase "one of the chief princes" (Dan. 10:13) could give the impression that He is one among many princes. But according to Revelation 12:7, Michael is the supreme leader of the heavenly angels, or "the great prince." When necessary, He personally assists angels in their assigned tasks (Dan. 10:13), yet the angelic hosts are under His command (Rev. 12:7). He is indeed the "archangel" (Jude 9). This title is mentioned in one other place in the Bible: 1 Thesselonians 4:16, in the context of the second coming of Christ. He returns "with the voice of the archangel," suggesting that Michael is most probably another name for Jesus.

3. He protects God's people: Michael is described as the Prince of Israel (Dan. 10:21), the One who protects Israel (Dan. 12:1). This protection is described in military terms and portrays the Prince as a warrior. In practically all the passages in which He is mentioned there is a conflict between God's people and their enemies, and Michael is present to defend them or fight for them. The protection can also take the form of judgment in which Michael stands up and defends and delivers God's people (ibid.). Those are functions of Christ in the New Testament and confirm the suggestion that Michael and Christ are the same person, involved in leadership in the heavenly and earthly realms.

4. He is Prince of the heavenly hosts: In Daniel 8:10 there is a reference to a celestial being who performs the daily services in the heavenly sanctuary. There is only one other passage in the Old Testament in which this being is mentioned. Joshua had an encounter with a being who identified himself as the "captain [commander] of the host [army] of the Lord" (Joshua 5:14). He ordered Joshua to remove his shoes because the ground he was standing on was holy, similar to God's apparition to Moses. The context makes clear that this being was the Lord Himself (Joshua 6:2). This Prince is the same person called in other passages Prince Michael, and therefore we can identify Him with the preincarnate Christ.

So even though the Bible does not clearly identify Michael with Christ, there is enough biblical information to warrant the view that They are the same person. The name Michael stresses the fact that Christ is the supreme leader of the heavenly angels and the defender of His people as warrior, judge, and priest.
" Lamanya satu ajaran dianut tidak akan membuat kesalahan menjadi kebenaran, sebab kebenaran mampu berdiri sendiri. Doktrin yang benar akan tetap teguh oleh penyelidikan Alkitab yang seksama. "
March 21, 2014, 02:05:18 PM
Reply #12
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@bro Malaikat suci
jadi bukan bicara tanpa dasar,,,

ini tanggapan resmi dari Adventist bible research institute mengenai michael yaitu nama lain dari Yesus,,,
michael itu nama/sebutan lain seperti Anak domba Allah, Batu karang, Singa dari Yehuda,
What biblical evidence supports the teaching that Michael is another name for Jesus?

The name Michael is used five times in the Bible to designate a celestial being (Dan. 10:13, 21; 12:1; Jude 9; Rev. 12:7). He is nowhere explicitly identified with Jesus, but some Christian writers have equated the two by carefully comparing the role played by Michael with that of Jesus. Any comparisons yield not only similarities but also dissimilarities, and both should be taken into account. We'll start with the passages in which Michael is mentioned and then broaden the horizon to include several passages that are conceptually related to His person and experience.

1. He seems to be an angel: Michael is identified as "one of the chief princes" (Dan. 10:13), "your prince" (verse 21), "the great prince" (Dan. 12:1), and "the archangel" (Jude 9). "Archangel" implies that He is the prince of the angels, suggesting that Michael cannot be another name for Jesus because He is divine and angels are created beings.

Part of the problem is that the noun "angel" is taken to designate a creature, while in the Bible it designates a function. In other words, an "angel" is a being who functions as a "messenger" of God. In most cases they are created beings, but there is an exception.

In the Old Testament there are several references to the "angel [messenger] of the Lord" in which He is equated with God (e.g., Ex. 3:2, 4; Judges 6:12, 14). It is not that the Messenger is identified with the One who sent Him as His representative, but rather that the Sender functions at the same time as the Messenger. Many Christians have identified the Angel of the Lord as the preincarnate Christ. This Christological interpretation seems to be biblically valid.

2. He is leader of the angels: The phrase "one of the chief princes" (Dan. 10:13) could give the impression that He is one among many princes. But according to Revelation 12:7, Michael is the supreme leader of the heavenly angels, or "the great prince." When necessary, He personally assists angels in their assigned tasks (Dan. 10:13), yet the angelic hosts are under His command (Rev. 12:7). He is indeed the "archangel" (Jude 9). This title is mentioned in one other place in the Bible: 1 Thesselonians 4:16, in the context of the second coming of Christ. He returns "with the voice of the archangel," suggesting that Michael is most probably another name for Jesus.

3. He protects God's people: Michael is described as the Prince of Israel (Dan. 10:21), the One who protects Israel (Dan. 12:1). This protection is described in military terms and portrays the Prince as a warrior. In practically all the passages in which He is mentioned there is a conflict between God's people and their enemies, and Michael is present to defend them or fight for them. The protection can also take the form of judgment in which Michael stands up and defends and delivers God's people (ibid.). Those are functions of Christ in the New Testament and confirm the suggestion that Michael and Christ are the same person, involved in leadership in the heavenly and earthly realms.

4. He is Prince of the heavenly hosts: In Daniel 8:10 there is a reference to a celestial being who performs the daily services in the heavenly sanctuary. There is only one other passage in the Old Testament in which this being is mentioned. Joshua had an encounter with a being who identified himself as the "captain [commander] of the host [army] of the Lord" (Joshua 5:14). He ordered Joshua to remove his shoes because the ground he was standing on was holy, similar to God's apparition to Moses. The context makes clear that this being was the Lord Himself (Joshua 6:2). This Prince is the same person called in other passages Prince Michael, and therefore we can identify Him with the preincarnate Christ.

So even though the Bible does not clearly identify Michael with Christ, there is enough biblical information to warrant the view that They are the same person. The name Michael stresses the fact that Christ is the supreme leader of the heavenly angels and the defender of His people as warrior, judge, and priest.
Jadi, pointnya adalah, Michael adalah Yesus bukan?

Tinggal jawab ya atau tidak, biar diskusinya gampang, jadi kalau Michael itu Yesus atau Yesus itu Michael, silahkan jawab ya, baru kita lanjutkan diskusi kita.

Salam
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March 21, 2014, 10:25:59 PM
Reply #13
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Jadi, pointnya adalah,
Salam

pointnya adalah ini :

So even though the Bible does not clearly identify Michael with Christ, there is enough biblical information to warrant the view that They are the same person. The name Michael stresses the fact that Christ is the supreme leader of the heavenly angels and the defender of His people as warrior, judge, and priest.

 :wink:

salam..
" Lamanya satu ajaran dianut tidak akan membuat kesalahan menjadi kebenaran, sebab kebenaran mampu berdiri sendiri. Doktrin yang benar akan tetap teguh oleh penyelidikan Alkitab yang seksama. "
March 21, 2014, 11:25:39 PM
Reply #14
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pointnya adalah ini :

So even though the Bible does not clearly identify Michael with Christ, there is enough biblical information to warrant the view that They are the same person. The name Michael stresses the fact that Christ is the supreme leader of the heavenly angels and the defender of His people as warrior, judge, and priest.

 :wink:

salam..
Selain si ellen white, adakah pengajaran iman Rasuli, sejak para Rasul sampai  para Bapa Gereja, bahwa Tuhan Yesus sebenarnya adalah Malaikat Michael?

Contoh:

Ignatius dan Polykarpus, murid langsung dari Yohanes Penginjil (yang menuliskan Injil Yohanes dan Kitab Wahyu), Ankletus dan Klement, murid langsung dari Simon Petrus, dst...

Adakah?

Salam
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March 24, 2014, 11:37:31 AM
Reply #15
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dan siapakah ingatius loyola, polykarpus, anakletus dan klement itu ???  :coolsmiley:

apakah mereka nabi Tuhan ? atau rasul ?? atau apalah....  :D

salam
Cilaka.... Padahal yang kamu quote sudah ada penjelasannya.

Yo wes lah..

Salam
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March 24, 2014, 11:48:14 AM
Reply #16
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Cilaka.... Padahal yang kamu quote sudah ada penjelasannya.

Yo wes lah..

Salam

Waktu Yohanes di buang ke pulopatmos dia sendiri, bukan dengan seorang teman....
salam..  :wink:
" Lamanya satu ajaran dianut tidak akan membuat kesalahan menjadi kebenaran, sebab kebenaran mampu berdiri sendiri. Doktrin yang benar akan tetap teguh oleh penyelidikan Alkitab yang seksama. "
March 24, 2014, 12:27:45 PM
Reply #17
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Waktu Yohanes di buang ke pulopatmos dia sendiri, bukan dengan seorang teman....
salam..  :wink:
Menurut si ellen ya?

Baiklah... Baiklah...

Salam
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March 24, 2014, 12:44:34 PM
Reply #18
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Menurut si ellen ya?

Baiklah... Baiklah...

Salam

yang menulis kitab Wahyu adalah Rasul Yohanes sendiri,
wahyu 1:1,2 1:1 Inilah wahyu Yesus Kristus, yang dikaruniakan Allah kepada-Nya, supaya ditunjukkan-Nya kepada hamba-hamba-Nya apa  yang harus segera terjadi. Dan oleh malaikat-Nya yang diutus-Nya,  Ia telah menyatakannya kepada hamba-Nya Yohanes.
1:2 Yohanes telah bersaksi tentang firman Allah dan tentang kesaksian yang diberikan oleh Yesus Kristus, yaitu segala sesuatu yang telah dilihatnya.


salam
« Last Edit: August 31, 2018, 05:05:59 PM by Simatupang@123 »
" Lamanya satu ajaran dianut tidak akan membuat kesalahan menjadi kebenaran, sebab kebenaran mampu berdiri sendiri. Doktrin yang benar akan tetap teguh oleh penyelidikan Alkitab yang seksama. "
March 24, 2014, 03:52:26 PM
Reply #19
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kamu kok dikit dikit larinya sama ellen sih,,, kamu naksir ya ?? dia itu sudah bersuami bro, dah punya anak tiga lagi,,, dan dia sudah meninggal seandainya hiduppun umurnya udah 200an tahun,,, insaf bro..  ;D
sory bro bercanda,,, hahahahahhahaha

yang menulis kitab Wahyu adalah Yohanes sendiri, itu adalah pengakuannya sendiri... bukan karena kata pastor ya bro tapi kata rasul Yohanes sendiri...
wahyu 1:1,2 1:1 Inilah wahyu Yesus Kristus, yang dikaruniakan Allah kepada-Nya, supaya ditunjukkan-Nya kepada hamba-hamba-Nya apa  yang harus segera terjadi. Dan oleh malaikat-Nya yang diutus-Nya,  Ia telah menyatakannya kepada hamba-Nya Yohanes.
1:2 Yohanes telah bersaksi tentang firman Allah dan tentang kesaksian yang diberikan oleh Yesus Kristus, yaitu segala sesuatu yang telah dilihatnya.


salam
Karena kamu tidak mengenal para murid langsung para Rasul, jadi modal kamu hanya Alkitab dan si ellen, trus gue musti bilang wow gitu?

Baiklah... Baiklah...

Salam
:angel: Kami adalah para Malaikat bersayap satu, yang hanya dapat terbang kalau berpelukan :angel:
 


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